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Post by omstem on Jan 27, 2021 3:10:53 GMT
Selluwud: I don't think any data is expected at the end of this month. May be some news from Japan sometime this year is expected. The So called EU Partnership talks have been going on for years. I have been a holder since last 5 years and I will hold till the binary event that I am hoping will happen this year with Japan results. This stock has a tendency to go up occasionally and never hold its gains. Good luck to all longs.
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Post by jamesjohnson12 on Jan 28, 2021 13:44:20 GMT
Has anybody been keeping up with the documents from the trial that have been posted on Reddit? They are pretty juicy. Both sides seem to be going for blood.
To me, it seems like ATHX has a legitimate claim that Hardy should not be privy to some of the information he is seeking. On the other hand, it seems like their governance procedures may not have been up to snuff and Hardy may have some legitimate claims that he was improperly excluded and that ATHX tried to cover their tracks after he sent his demands. ATHX contends that Hardy is seeking proprietary information about their manufacturing processes for less than benign reasons, which has been surmised by some posters but has now been laid out in the open by the court documents. Maybe both sides are right in some respects and wrong in others. It seems clear that they both believe in the value of Multistem or this whole endeavor would be a huge waste of resources over nothing.
Curious to the thoughts of other contributors - specifically, JCKRDU - I feel like he always has a reasonable opinion and good insight.
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hort
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Post by hort on Jan 30, 2021 22:27:55 GMT
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Post by jamesjohnson12 on Jan 31, 2021 0:55:57 GMT
Yeah, I think it shows that Hardy likely thinks that a partnership proposal is forthcoming, which is bullish for shareholders.
My WAG is that he wants to be notified when a partnership deal is proposed in advance so that he and Sasei have time to counter with a sweeter deal. I’m guessing that he believes Gil will accept a smaller deal with a better global partner (maybe in the very near term). This motion would give him the time to counter with a sweeter deal that he will claim is better for shareholder value, but gives Healios a bigger piece of the pie. I think I would rather have a true global partner at a lower value (upfront payment) deal...
Maybe reading way too much into this, but conspiracy theories seem to be all the rage these days.
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hort
Full Member
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Post by hort on Jan 31, 2021 1:18:47 GMT
Yeah, I think it shows that Hardy likely thinks that a partnership proposal is forthcoming, which is bullish for shareholders. My WAG is that he wants to be notified when a partnership deal is proposed in advance so that he and Sasei have time to counter with a sweeter deal. I’m guessing that he believes Gil will accept a smaller deal with a better global partner (maybe in the very near term). This motion would give him the time to counter with a sweeter deal that he will claim is better for shareholder value, but gives Healios a bigger piece of the pie. I think I would rather have a true global partner at a lower value (upfront payment) deal... Maybe reading way too much into this, but conspiracy theories seem to be all the rage these days. I basically completely agree with this |
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Post by selluwud on Jan 31, 2021 12:03:42 GMT
Yeah, I think it shows that Hardy likely thinks that a partnership proposal is forthcoming, which is bullish for shareholders. My WAG is that he wants to be notified when a partnership deal is proposed in advance so that he and Sasei have time to counter with a sweeter deal. I’m guessing that he believes Gil will accept a smaller deal with a better global partner (maybe in the very near term). This motion would give him the time to counter with a sweeter deal that he will claim is better for shareholder value, but gives Healios a bigger piece of the pie. I think I would rather have a true global partner at a lower value (upfront payment) deal... Maybe reading way too much into this, but conspiracy theories seem to be all the rage these days. It's been one crazy ride hitched onto this company with its cellular based therapy giving hope to all the believers of the science. Coming to fruition and becoming approved has been a carrot on a stick that keeps investors holding for the long term. Being closer to the ever creeping end goal has been the incentive to stay invested with the rewards close on the horizon. Your take on Hardy's actions make as much sense as any other, we can only hold out for so long before the rubber meets the road. GLTA |
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Post by jckrdu on Feb 1, 2021 0:13:43 GMT
Has anybody been keeping up with the documents from the trial that have been posted on Reddit? They are pretty juicy. Both sides seem to be going for blood. To me, it seems like ATHX has a legitimate claim that Hardy should not be privy to some of the information he is seeking. On the other hand, it seems like their governance procedures may not have been up to snuff and Hardy may have some legitimate claims that he was improperly excluded and that ATHX tried to cover their tracks after he sent his demands. ATHX contends that Hardy is seeking proprietary information about their manufacturing processes for less than benign reasons, which has been surmised by some posters but has now been laid out in the open by the court documents. Maybe both sides are right in some respects and wrong in others. It seems clear that they both believe in the value of Multistem or this whole endeavor would be a huge waste of resources over nothing. Curious to the thoughts of other contributors - specifically, JCKRDU - I feel like he always has a reasonable opinion and good insight. Agree that both sides will likely prevail on some points. Helios likely asking for too much given that they’re a commercial partner and therefore have some conflicts. I also think that Athersys management likely went too far on their use of the “Executive Committee”. Holding a good sized position in Athx. Looking forward to a move a little higher before Ards and stroke data ... coming soon. EU partnership can happen any time. GL all. |
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Post by selluwud on Feb 1, 2021 15:07:43 GMT
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Post by jamesjohnson12 on Feb 1, 2021 16:43:16 GMT
Has anybody been keeping up with the documents from the trial that have been posted on Reddit? They are pretty juicy. Both sides seem to be going for blood. To me, it seems like ATHX has a legitimate claim that Hardy should not be privy to some of the information he is seeking. On the other hand, it seems like their governance procedures may not have been up to snuff and Hardy may have some legitimate claims that he was improperly excluded and that ATHX tried to cover their tracks after he sent his demands. ATHX contends that Hardy is seeking proprietary information about their manufacturing processes for less than benign reasons, which has been surmised by some posters but has now been laid out in the open by the court documents. Maybe both sides are right in some respects and wrong in others. It seems clear that they both believe in the value of Multistem or this whole endeavor would be a huge waste of resources over nothing. Curious to the thoughts of other contributors - specifically, JCKRDU - I feel like he always has a reasonable opinion and good insight. Agree that both sides will likely prevail on some points. Helios likely asking for too much given that they’re a commercial partner and therefore have some conflicts. I also think that Athersys management likely went too far on their use of the “Executive Committee”. Holding a good sized position in Athx. Looking forward to a move a little higher before Ards and stroke data ... coming soon. EU partnership can happen any time. GL all. Great, thank you for your thoughts. I am hoping we get a little run up in anticipation of the trial (w Hardy) and investor day. Some positive news prior would be awesome as well. I think Gil could get a lot of investors back on his side if he released a positive update on EU partner talks (like an MOU). I think February will end up being a very interesting month for ATHX investors and hopefully Hardy gets his two trials fully enrolled by the end of the month as well. |
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Post by jamesjohnson12 on Feb 1, 2021 21:01:22 GMT
Wow...incredible volume and SP movement today. I hope we can sustain it with some AH news.
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Post by jamesjohnson12 on Feb 2, 2021 21:36:45 GMT
Huge volume to close green for the day >8mm shares. Could this be Sasei starting to invest? If so, do they have to file a disclosure only once they reach 5% ownership? Or does their relationship with Hardy/Healios require an immediate disclosure?
Not saying it is them, but it lines up with the fact that they closed the fund in late January and seems to meet their investment criteria. Interesting times...
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Post by selluwud on Feb 3, 2021 22:58:13 GMT
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Post by selluwud on Feb 4, 2021 12:45:01 GMT
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Post by CM kipper007 on Feb 6, 2021 1:32:05 GMT
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Post by jamesjohnson12 on Feb 8, 2021 18:53:17 GMT
More interesting posts on the reddit board...
One of the members over there posted a highly redacted motion drawn up by Hardy's attorneys. It is clear that ATHX has been talking to a potential partner since at least October 2020. Hardy contends that he should be apprised of the contents of those discussions, but the ATHX board thinks otherwise. The subject of the motion is almost entirely on the prospect of a "transaction" with a partner. At one point, ATHX offers to disclose the discussions to Hardy as long as Hardy {redacted}. Hardy rejected this offer. Really interested to know what that offer was because it would be telling.
Anyway, if you read through all the redacted portions of the motion - it really gets your imagination running. Hardy may have a point that he is entitled to this information and ATHX may have a valid concern about Hardy having access to the information. It will be interesting to see how it plays out.
However, it is more apparent than ever that there is a partnership in the works. And, I do not think it will be surprising to see it announced about 3 weeks after this litigation is cleared up (since the court granted Hardy's motion to give him the 15 business day notice prior to entering into any decision). This is as entertained as I have been through nearly 5 years of ATHX investment. I hope this is a sufficient carrot to keep the stock price moving up until investor day.
Would love to hear any other's thoughts or anything that jumps out at them. One other piece that was interesting was that Hardy specifically pointed out ATHX's cash in hand and cash burn and then there is a redacted section that says "ATHX does not expect {redacted}" It is a long section and I think it implies that ATHX does not expect to have to implement another public offering - which means that a partnership with up front cash is coming in the short term...fun to try and read the tea leaves.
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Post by lcd on Feb 8, 2021 22:00:28 GMT
I have been sitting on the same shares for 3.5 years and I agree this is the most interesting time to be holding shares. It is certainly easy to speculate about a big partnership or even buyout based on these court filings. I am not planning to add any shares right now, but I am definitely not selling. I am not sure why anyone would sell this stock right now.
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Post by CM kipper007 on Feb 8, 2021 23:17:45 GMT
More interesting posts on the reddit board... One of the members over there posted a highly redacted motion drawn up by Hardy's attorneys. It is clear that ATHX has been talking to a potential partner since at least October 2020. Hardy contends that he should be apprised of the contents of those discussions, but the ATHX board thinks otherwise. The subject of the motion is almost entirely on the prospect of a "transaction" with a partner. At one point, ATHX offers to disclose the discussions to Hardy as long as Hardy {redacted}. Hardy rejected this offer. Really interested to know what that offer was because it would be telling. Anyway, if you read through all the redacted portions of the motion - it really gets your imagination running. Hardy may have a point that he is entitled to this information and ATHX may have a valid concern about Hardy having access to the information. It will be interesting to see how it plays out. However, it is more apparent than ever that there is a partnership in the works. And, I do not think it will be surprising to see it announced about 3 weeks after this litigation is cleared up (since the court granted Hardy's motion to give him the 15 business day notice prior to entering into any decision). This is as entertained as I have been through nearly 5 years of ATHX investment. I hope this is a sufficient carrot to keep the stock price moving up until investor day. Would love to hear any other's thoughts or anything that jumps out at them. One other piece that was interesting was that Hardy specifically pointed out ATHX's cash in hand and cash burn and then there is a redacted section that says "ATHX does not expect {redacted}" It is a long section and I think it implies that ATHX does not expect to have to implement another public offering - which means that a partnership with up front cash is coming in the short term...fun to try and read the tea leaves. Hey James, I am very much of the opinion that Hardy has not only invested, but shown real belief in the product. We have been touting MS around for a long time. And yet Hardy has been the only one to commit and partner with us. I know they are late getting the trials completed, but I think they are moving faster that Athersys has done in a very difficult time. Where would we be without the Healios data if it wasn't coming? I almost feel like Gil owes Hardy a little... (but I really am no businessman), and that I really wish they would be closer. I'd like the conversation to be open to Hardy to not only offer advice, but allow him to change his position with ownership in the company if he wishes. If he would like to own more, then great, (if it doesn't cause issues with obligations owning over certain percentages etc.) I don't want another partner to come in late to the game, then take a higher ranking position that Hardy. Am I being silly thinking this? |
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Post by jamesjohnson12 on Feb 9, 2021 13:29:34 GMT
More interesting posts on the reddit board... One of the members over there posted a highly redacted motion drawn up by Hardy's attorneys. It is clear that ATHX has been talking to a potential partner since at least October 2020. Hardy contends that he should be apprised of the contents of those discussions, but the ATHX board thinks otherwise. The subject of the motion is almost entirely on the prospect of a "transaction" with a partner. At one point, ATHX offers to disclose the discussions to Hardy as long as Hardy {redacted}. Hardy rejected this offer. Really interested to know what that offer was because it would be telling. Anyway, if you read through all the redacted portions of the motion - it really gets your imagination running. Hardy may have a point that he is entitled to this information and ATHX may have a valid concern about Hardy having access to the information. It will be interesting to see how it plays out. However, it is more apparent than ever that there is a partnership in the works. And, I do not think it will be surprising to see it announced about 3 weeks after this litigation is cleared up (since the court granted Hardy's motion to give him the 15 business day notice prior to entering into any decision). This is as entertained as I have been through nearly 5 years of ATHX investment. I hope this is a sufficient carrot to keep the stock price moving up until investor day. Would love to hear any other's thoughts or anything that jumps out at them. One other piece that was interesting was that Hardy specifically pointed out ATHX's cash in hand and cash burn and then there is a redacted section that says "ATHX does not expect {redacted}" It is a long section and I think it implies that ATHX does not expect to have to implement another public offering - which means that a partnership with up front cash is coming in the short term...fun to try and read the tea leaves. Hey James, I am very much of the opinion that Hardy has not only invested, but shown real belief in the product. We have been touting MS around for a long time. And yet Hardy has been the only one to commit and partner with us. I know they are late getting the trials completed, but I think they are moving faster that Athersys has done in a very difficult time. Where would we be without the Healios data if it wasn't coming? I almost feel like Gil owes Hardy a little... (but I really am no businessman), and that I really wish they would be closer. I'd like the conversation to be open to Hardy to not only offer advice, but allow him to change his position with ownership in the company if he wishes. If he would like to own more, then great, (if it doesn't cause issues with obligations owning over certain percentages etc.) I don't want another partner to come in late to the game, then take a higher ranking position that Hardy. Am I being silly thinking this? No, I think that does make sense. It seems like Hardy and Gil should have each other's backs on this. If Multistem is successful, they are both going to reap considerable benefits and Hardy has put his money where his mouth is with regards to his support of Multistem along with progressing far in 2 extremely important trials. It is unfortunate that they are not working as a team so to speak. However, I do think a new partner with a global network and considerable experience with commercializing new treatments will be invaluable to the eventual success of the company. So, I do think ATHX needs to branch out from just Helios. However, I do think Helios deserves a lot of credit as well as a seat at the table going forward. For whatever reason, the executive board has decided to exclude Hardy from their discussions by claiming that he is a conflicted board member. They may or may not have a good case for claiming this (we will find out soon enough with the trial, but I am guessing not). On top of that, they have explicitly stated that Hardy has less than benign reasons for wanting involvement in these discussions. I am curious as to what proof they have of this or whether it is just speculation. It is a pretty serious allegation so I am guessing they have more evidence than just a "hunch". Either way, I think it is strange and has significantly strained the relationship between the two sides. I hope the judge can provide a ruling, both sides accept it, and that they can go back to working together towards a common goal. |
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Post by lcd on Feb 9, 2021 14:05:32 GMT
One thing that confuses me about the mistrust between Healios and Athersys is that if MultiStem works as we all hope, then Healios is way too small to buy out Athersys or even offer a real international partnership beyond Japan. It is unclear to me if Healios just wants to get in on any international deal (which they are not entitled to based on my understanding of the partnership) or if Healios is concerned they might somehow lose their rights for Japan. The pessimist in me also wonders if Healios thinks MultiStem might not be effective for strokes, but sees its value elsewhere for ARDS or other less common applications and does want to position themselves for a buyout if the TREASURE trial doesn't meet endpoints.
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Post by CM kipper007 on Feb 9, 2021 17:51:12 GMT
One thing that confuses me about the mistrust between Healios and Athersys is that if MultiStem works as we all hope, then Healios is way too small to buy out Athersys or even offer a real international partnership beyond Japan. It is unclear to me if Healios just wants to get in on any international deal (which they are not entitled to based on my understanding of the partnership) or if Healios is concerned they might somehow lose their rights for Japan. The pessimist in me also wonders if Healios thinks MultiStem might not be effective for strokes, but sees its value elsewhere for ARDS or other less common applications and does want to position themselves for a buyout if the TREASURE trial doesn't meet endpoints.
LCD, I was thinking that maybe Healios would want to up their stake to take on the Asian market. Healios might not be big enough for a global player, but they certainly could reach out to China, Korea etc. And I would like them to have the option before someone else comes to the table. Hardy has shown belief in the therapy. |
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